Why “Healthy Eating” Is Confusing Everyone

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It's upsetting to know what's happened 
to the food industry. It's horrible.

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Businesses want to make money. All the 
theory behind nutrition. What do you do

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with it? I think it is over complicated. But then 
I wouldn't have a job if it was less complicated.

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[music]

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You need to become very savvy when it comes to 
label reading. Look at things that you don't

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recognize. And if you don't recognize, question 
it. What is the biggest red flag within the label?

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The biggest red flag for me on any label is 
something that says whenever [music] you go

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to buy anything, there is an impulse buy section 
which is there to make you want to buy something.

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What have they done to our food? Breakfast. Is it 
the most important meal of the day? It depends on

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who you are. On the subject of sweets, sugar is 
very inflammatory. If you've took sugar off the

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table and we didn't eat another sugary thing in 
our lives, we would still find enough. The human

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body does not need sugar. And a heavier bread is 
more likely to have less ingredients in it. The

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softer they are, the more red flagish it is. Yes. 
Not every ultrarocessed food is a dangerous food.

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Is vegetable oil a processed food? Yes. Try and 
listen to your body more than you listen to social

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media. What are we snacking on? So, ideally, we 
would not have to snack. Most of us should be able

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to go between meals without eating. We shouldn't 
need to snack. When we listen to our bodies,

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our bodies will tell us exactly what we need. 
one takeaway for people, what would it be? Um,

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something that I haven't already said. Um, 
Jenny, hello. Welcome to Beyond the Boardroom.

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Thank you. So, we were having a little 
informal chat, weren't we, about um

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all the theory behind nutrition and it's 
completely and utterly overwhelming. It is at

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the moment, I think. Yeah. Yes. And what does it 
all mean? How do we We We've had great podcasts,

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but I've brought you on to just take, you know, 
all that theory. Let's take it and let's Now,

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this is all about applying it in easy digestible 
chunks. I love what you did there. [laughter]

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I'm going to eat my nutrition. Yes. Yeah. Because 
we want to just um like what do you do with it?

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What do you do with all the information as in 
what do you eat? Yeah. Absolutely. I think it

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is over complicated but then I wouldn't have a 
job if it was less complicated. So that is my

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job to be that kind of you know take you from all 
the theory to actually what the heck did you put

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on your plate you know that this is the conundrum 
and we're so time poor you know our lives are so

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busy now whatever stage of life you're at your 
life is busy and it's over busy and we just do

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not leave enough time when we compare the time 
we leave for cooking preparation etc to perhaps

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how people would have done that and even if you 
look at the design of our houses and our kitchens

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they're not really set up for food preparation 
as we would have considered it Back in the day,

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we talk about food prep now, like we do, you know, 
four chicken breasts and some rice and some veg,

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you know, ahead of a week of work. But that's 
not what we really meant by food prep back in

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the day. There would be processes involved 
that would take you from raw materials to a

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a cooked meal. Raw materials do anymore. Yeah. 
Raw materials to a meal. Okay. I mean, I I I don't

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know what you mean by a change of design for our 
kitchens. So, we've got the kitchens we've got.

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We're in the situation we're in. We're all busy. 
Okay. We've all heard this this information coming

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to us about ultrarocessed foods and we know that 
it's a food that's been processed too much and now

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it's bad for us. Can you That's a really good way 
of putting it. I like that. [laughter] Why didn't

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I think of that? And elaborate on that. So, what 
is it when we're looking on shelves? What is it?

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It will be a food that has uh lots of ingredients. 
Step one, ingredients that you have perhaps not

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heard of before. So they will sound I know 
people say this and it's very cliche but a

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little bit more like a chemistry experiment than 
the sort of things you'd find in your kitchen.

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But if you think about some of the things that 
perhaps you did you or were aware of growing up,

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things like artificial colors or artificial 
flavoring, it's like that but times X now

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because now we're looking at things that have 
got emulsifiers and stabilizers. There's a whole

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range of artificial sweeteners and I think that 
would be a podcast in its own right because it's

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so complicated. I was going to say if I ask you 
what is an emulsifier, what is a stabilizer? We're

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podcast and we're moving away from that. So 
basically what do you do? Yeah. So you need to

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become very savvy when it comes to label reading 
but we haven't got time necessarily to do that.

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So the easiest thing that you could do is you 
know cook from scratch but scratch really means

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different things to different people. So, there 
are variations on that and perhaps that's what

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we'll, you know, we'll discuss. But, you know, I 
would say meat that looks like it's come from an

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animal. Um, nuts, seeds, whole grains, vegetables, 
and you know where those vegetables have come

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from, the ground, a tree, whatever. Um, I'm trying 
to think if there's anything I've forgotten there.

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Oily fish as well. You know, this is a a whole 
foods diet. These are recognizable foods. We don't

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need to be considering things that are beyond 
that, but we do because because we're time poor.

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I think this is where we need to ask questions 
about where our food is coming from. I don't think

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people ask enough questions in certain contexts 
that we talk about when you go to the supermarket

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label reading, but then equally some people will 
read every single label and then have takeaways

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three nights a week and not even think about 
how that's being prepared. So, it's consistency

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because you're saying a food with a lot of a meal 
with a lot of ingredients, but then you go to a

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really nice restaurant. Let's say you want to go 
to a nice Italian restaurant and you're having a

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beautiful seafood pasta and there's lots and lots 
of lovely things in there. You have no idea what,

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but it's nice. Yeah. Is that an ultrarocessed 
food? It's unlikely that it is if it's been

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cooked in the kitchen. And you know, most Italian 
restaurants, if we think about the culture of

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Italian restaurants and how Italian immigrants 
arrived, they brought their food culture with

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them. They set up restaurants as one of the 
industries, the sort of founding industries,

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and they've prepared food from scratch 
since the day dot. But then take that,

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literally take that example and look at the number 
of adverts that give you the impression that the

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pizza or pasta sauce that you're going to buy 
from the supermarket was cooked by your Italian

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grandmother. Now we're moving into ultrarocessed. 
So the Italian restaurant, great. The food that

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tells you it's authentic and Italian, not great. 
No. and I'm in marketing and that upsets me a lot.

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I used to be in marketing too and I look 
at it through my daughter's studying

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marketing at university and I do look 
at things through a very different lens.

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I could only see the positive in marketing back in 
the day and now I see how it can be used but also

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very easily misused and people can misunderstand a 
lot very easily because we're so time poor. Yeah,

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that Yeah. [laughter] Well, that's um pulling 
the wool over one's eyes. It's not prepared by

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a grandmother. It's prepared in a factory. And 
I suppose that's what you're saying. When it's

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in a factory and there's these things being added 
to it that we don't know what these things are

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and they won't grow in nature and you won't pick 
them off a tree, they there is something going on.

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So the biggest change so from that all we can 
take that we need to look at the label. Yeah.

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Look at the things we don't know. And 
that's a red flag. Don't buy it. Yeah.

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Look at things that you don't recognize and if 
you don't recognize question it. I mean I find

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it harder as I get older because I have to take my 
my glasses my specs with me when I go shopping. So

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you know that standing in the supermarket 
holding it further and further away. But

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you know the reality take a photo and 
then enlarge it. Well there is that too

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and and and you know this this happens to 
us because we are so well I am particularly

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doing what I do but so focused on trying to find 
better alternatives. I'd love like anybody else

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I think I'd love to have the time to cook 
from scratch. I write cookery books. I do

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cook from scratch, but I'm always trying to find, 
if I'm truly honest, hand on heart, I'm trying to

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find a quicker way because I understand that not 
everyone's going to be in the kitchen all day like

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I am some days. Yeah. My parents cook from 
scratch and uh when my dad comes to visit me,

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he makes me spend the whole day with him in the 
kitchen and he gets really frustrated. He's like,

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"We need to make the stock and then we need 
to do this and then we need to I'm like, "Dad,

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what a beautiful thing he does." I love it. I 
love it. But it's so time consuming. It is. Yeah,

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but it is also an area, a time in your life where 
you do have connection. And my my mom worked

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full-time. I'm the youngest of seven children. The 
kitchen was a galley kitchen. And I kid you not,

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I probably got the most steps in by trying to 
speak to my mom of an evening while she prepared

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an evening meal. And all you had to do was she'd 
just say, I don't think she'd even say you just

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automatically move as she reached for the ladle 
or the wooden spoon or the knife or whatever.

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And and it was just that immersive experience. I 
don't even know that I knew that I was learning

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how to cook. But the six six out of the seven 
of us, I would say, are very good cooks.

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I apologize to the person who I've just missed out 
of that list, but you know that it because that's

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how we grew up. We grew up around a mother 
that did cook and she was working full-time,

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but it's still so important to have 
a cook meal every evening. Okay. So,

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there's two things that are coming from this. Um 
the first one, if you can answer this, is what is

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the biggest red flag within the label? That's one. 
And then the second one is a lot of us do cook,

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you know, the basics like a chicken breast 
with some potato and whatever some vegetables,

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but we really fall down on the other things, the 
cereals, the the whatever the the drinks that we

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might drink, snacks. So, so could you answer those 
two? How do we prevent that? What what's that red

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flag and how do we prevent the other one? Yeah, 
sure. So, probably the biggest uh sort of one

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area of or one set of ingredients within the 
ultrarocessed um kind of area rephrase that.

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The the biggest uh red flag for me on any label is 
something that says emulsifier or stabilizer. Now,

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the unfortunate thing is it doesn't always call 
that out as an emulsifier or a stabilizer. So,

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it's almost better to become aware of what they 
are. So, they're gums generally. um so guag gum,

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zantham gum etc and emulsifiers. Now the the 
most amount of research has been done on CMC,

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caroxymethyl cellulose and polyorbate 80 and those 
are ones that we should be aware of and we should

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be looking on the labels of our food but I think 
when it comes to foods that contain those they are

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quite prevalent in our diet and a lot of 
our kind of free from foods for example

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um so you know you're free from dairy milks and 
you're um free from loaves your uh gluten-free

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loaves your gluten-free pizza bases A lot of 
those will contain them, but even a lot of our

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dairy products will contain like um yogurts for 
example, ice cream. So, they're an area that I

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would look to if you can remove. That's really 
really difficult. What do they do to you? Well,

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the research suggests that it affects the gut 
and the gut lining. And what we do know is that

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that can create inflammation. And inflammation is 
at the root the root cause of everything that we

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know to be lifestyle related. So, anything we can 
do to reduce inflammation is a good thing. And we

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know that a diet that's higher in antioxidants. 
So, look, if you're someone that's like traveling

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loads with work and you're not in control of 
what you're eating um in terms of, you know,

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you don't know whether you're going to be eating 
something with emulsifiers and stabilizers,

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it's sort of beyond your control. What you are in 
control of is what you eat in the other meals or

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whilst you're traveling. Then really up your 
antioxidants. You know, think about brightly

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colored fruits, vegetables. The color should come 
from the fruit or vegetable, not the packaging.

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Because of course, that's what again manufacturers 
have done a really good job of making, you know,

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a whole aisle of a supermarket look really bright 
and colorful because we do eat with our eyes, but

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we don't need to be, you know, the allure doesn't 
need to be in the packaging. It needs to be in the

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natural color of these foods. Um, so that's what 
we should be looking for. Okay, so those are the

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the red flags. And then when it comes to our 
cooking and most of us are actually well most

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a lot of us do cook you know we think we're all if 
you have to ask people most people think they're

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generally quite healthy and I would use the word 
generally it's the other stuff it's all the snacks

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and everything y sweetened yogurts I'm going to 
not the Greek yogurts you know what what else

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I mean anything that you're going to have in 
between meals but again that says more about

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our culture and the way that we live our lives you 
know we we fair enough people are going to snack

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but if you look again How you know marketing is 
sort of think about the impulse purchases and how

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whenever you go to buy anything whether you're in 
a supermarket whether you're buying a rail ticket

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whether you're in you know a shop somewhere there 
is an impulse buy section which is there to make

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you want to buy something and it's going to be a 
snack it's ideally going to be you know nuts or

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fruit but it's very rarely that and you know if 
you stop at any service station in the UK there

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will be by every till that you go you you're going 
to check out. There'll be something that's there

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to to We were just in in Devon recently and family 
and my mother-in-law came with. We were driving.

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We had to stop at the service station and my 
husband was like, "Should we get a McDonald's?"

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And I was like, "No, we're not going to 
get a McDonald's. That's really I I don't

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want it." And I got frustrated because I already 
knew that I wasn't eating that healthy. I was on

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trainings, you know, they were they were having 
a little trip, but I had to do training and I was

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already I knew that I had biscuits there and 
I thought, "Oh no, not McDonald's, please."

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Then I looked around and I was like, well, what 
are the choices? Gregs, McDonald's. What? Why?

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Why isn't there a whole food beautiful farm? I 
don't know, something. Why? [laughter] It's just

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not commercially viable. I mean, there there's 
a really good services on the M25 that recently

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lost its Leon. I mean, Leon was probably 
the best alternative to a McDonald's. Yes,

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you had to pay more for it, but if you wanted that 
kind of, you know, fast food fix on a journey,

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that was a great place to stop. And the fact 
it's gone and it's been replaced by actually, I

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think it's a premon Starbucks. I'm not sure. But, 
you know, that means there the choices that were

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available are not now. It's just not there. The 
healthy choices are not there. And then you go in

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and there will be a marks and spent. So, so thank 
goodness for that. And you might be able to get

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some berries which you haven't washed cuz you're 
not by a tap with a clean [laughter] water. So

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you're eating all your chemicals or your choice 
is some sandwich which is also ultrarocessed

0:14:20.200,0:14:24.640
or some chocolate or some crisps or it's 
absolutely devastating. Why can't they give

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us a smoothie with some nice real fruit and you 
know the the best thing you can do is buy a banana

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cuz you can peel that and eat it. Yeah, that's 
not a bad choice. Uh yeah, I mean you can do so

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limited. Some of the I do a lot of corporate 
well-being and some of the companies I've

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worked with have people that are out on the road 
all the time. They work through the night of the

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sorts of places that are going to be open 
for them to grab something whilst they're out

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and what's available is so shocking. I mean, you 
know, it's it's very very hard for me to advise

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anybody on what they should be doing when they're 
in those when they have that that fewer choice

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those fewer choices to make from, you know, 
it's very hard. So, I totally get that.

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Travel with food maybe was something someone 
else said which is was quite good advice.

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Okay. So, breakfast, is it the most important 
meal of the day? And if it is, uh, what shouldn't

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we be eating? Let me I'm I'm rephrasing the 
question that I was originally going to ask

0:15:23.120,0:15:27.440
based on what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. 
So, um, it depends on who you are. Like,

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I I do a lot of content creation, a lot of 
social media, and I do understand that people

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don't like nuance, but I'm afraid it exists. You 
know, for some people, breakfast is absolutely

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their best meal of hands up, that's my favorite 
meal of the day. I almost live for my breakfast,

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but I am a morning person. You know, if you 
look at chronotypes, and this is where we

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look at what's going on with the sort of hormone 
levels in your body. I am such a lark. I get up

0:15:55.960,0:16:01.400
early in the morning and quite frankly, I am ready 
to go to bed nice and early in the evening, too.

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However, if you're more of an owl, you know, 
you're probably not a breakfast person. You're

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probably somebody but but but you do need to 
plan for when you get hungry, but you're probably

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somebody that benefits more from a brunch. But 
I would say that first meal of the day is really

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important and it does need to be a really balanced 
meal. And again, um, you know, we we have had,

0:16:20.200,0:16:24.400
uh, I think a lot of messaging over the years 
about what a good breakfast looks like, but you

0:16:24.400,0:16:29.120
only need to travel to, you know, somewhere in 
the Middle East or somewhere in South America or

0:16:29.120,0:16:35.320
go to Japan and you get to see a very different 
version of what breakfast looks like. And and

0:16:35.320,0:16:41.520
breakfast in a lot of countries is not a different 
meal from any of your other meals. Um, you know,

0:16:41.520,0:16:47.480
it is what we might consider here in the UK to be 
more suitable for a lunch or an evening meal. Yes.

0:16:47.480,0:16:52.240
Yeah. I noticed that. Yeah. When you say, "Oh, 
you have to eat protein with your breakfast." And,

0:16:52.240,0:16:56.720
you know, yes, you might have the bacon, which 
bacon is not ultrarocessed, really bad for you.

0:16:56.720,0:17:01.520
And then, yeah, you think, but but we're eating 
dinner for breakfast. It is a strange. Yeah.

0:17:02.240,0:17:06.320
You know, and there should be no problem with 
that. And I think again this is about a mindset

0:17:06.320,0:17:11.240
change you know where if you have traveled and 
you have seen that you understand that you if

0:17:11.240,0:17:15.080
somebody says to you when you're having a bowl 
of cornflakes every morning you've got to get

0:17:15.080,0:17:19.120
your protein in. That's a big step change for 
you. Where are you going to get your protein?

0:17:19.120,0:17:22.600
You probably think oh maybe the milk. You 
know I where am I going to get my protein

0:17:22.600,0:17:26.080
when I'm having cornflakes for breakfast. But if 
someone says to you like you're already having

0:17:26.080,0:17:31.480
two eggs for breakfast. You need to get more 
protein. That's a really easy step up. You know

0:17:31.480,0:17:36.120
add another egg in there. If you want a bit more 
fiber, put some avocado. If you want to add a bit

0:17:36.120,0:17:40.000
more fiber, put some maybe some change your white 
toast to your whole grain sourdough or something

0:17:40.000,0:17:44.800
like that. It's a very easy change in mindset for 
the person that's already, you know, thinking of

0:17:44.800,0:17:51.040
their breakfast more like a lunch or an evening. 
Breakfast is so nice. Like bacon and eggs and

0:17:51.040,0:17:59.240
beans and nice toast, you know, you kind of and 
um but so so is yogurt with berries and Yeah. And

0:17:59.240,0:18:02.880
again, I But those are breakfasty things. They're 
breakfasty things, but we don't have to look far

0:18:02.880,0:18:08.480
to where those sort of the origins of those things 
came from. I mean, growing up, we didn't have like

0:18:08.480,0:18:13.840
a lot of yogurt even, you know, plain yogurt, 
yes, but we wouldn't have had like a fruit yogurt.

0:18:13.840,0:18:19.560
And therefore, yogurt wasn't, you know, anything 
kind of that to be aware of. I didn't have to

0:18:19.560,0:18:26.560
worry about modified m starch or any stabilizers 
or any sweeteners or any coloring in my yogurt as

0:18:26.560,0:18:31.600
a child because I just have plain yogurt. Yeah, 
there wasn't any. things have changed, you know,

0:18:31.600,0:18:35.280
and that's and that's where it's almost like it's 
almost like a game and you have to kind of keep

0:18:35.280,0:18:39.480
up with the rules and the rules keep changing and 
that's where it feels like it's unfair to people

0:18:39.480,0:18:44.040
that don't do what I do. What have they done to 
our food or what have we cuz it's humans. We've

0:18:44.040,0:18:49.360
done it to our own food. Yeah, we've accepted 
it. Um, but I also think that uh, you know,

0:18:49.360,0:18:53.120
there's a lot of money to be made when you start 
using people. I've had somebody said this to me

0:18:53.120,0:18:58.400
the other day. There are more ingredients in 
that one and and yet it's cheaper, you know,

0:18:58.400,0:19:03.600
or there are fewer ingredient. I think it was um, 
I was comparing crisps. Yes. You know, and I was

0:19:03.600,0:19:09.320
comparing a baked crisp, which ostensibly is, you 
know, healthier. It tells you it is on the back,

0:19:09.320,0:19:13.320
you know, versus an olive oil crisp. I don't eat 
crisps that often, but if I'm going to eat them,

0:19:13.320,0:19:18.200
I'd probably eat the olive oil ones. Olive oil 
crisps. Yeah, because you know fewer ingredients.

0:19:18.200,0:19:22.800
Yes, they're so much more expensive. But it's 
the point that the ingredients are expensive when

0:19:22.800,0:19:27.800
they're real ingredients. It's when you put all of 
the additives in, they're a lot cheaper for cheap

0:19:27.800,0:19:31.960
and they give the food longevity. They give the 
food shelf life and that's what people really

0:19:31.960,0:19:35.760
want. They want to be able to, you know, come 
back in a year's time and if don't worry if those

0:19:35.760,0:19:39.720
baked crisps haven't sold because they'll still 
be in date. We can still make money off them.

0:19:39.720,0:19:45.120
So think about that sitting of years [laughter] 
old crisps in a packet. Yeah. Things that

0:19:45.120,0:19:50.280
you come back to a year later and they still 
look the same. They're probably not for you.

0:19:51.120,0:19:55.480
Yeah. Same with bread when it lasts a little bit 
too long. I think in in the States it lasts for

0:19:55.480,0:19:59.760
a very long time, doesn't it? Yeah. And and 
you know, again, you have to look only Yeah.

0:19:59.760,0:20:05.320
across the Atlantic to find that there is um some 
interesting there are some interesting ingredients

0:20:05.320,0:20:09.960
that have been added to bread over the course of 
time and sugar being one of them. And if you go to

0:20:09.960,0:20:16.040
the US and you ask for rye bread, for example, it 
doesn't look and taste anything like the rye bread

0:20:16.040,0:20:22.400
that you know I've had. I've married a a half 
German um his father used to get the bread from

0:20:22.400,0:20:27.720
a German baker in Ireland growing up and you know 
so that's the rye bread that I was introduced to

0:20:27.720,0:20:33.120
standard. I love German rye bread going you 
know you really have to chew it but if you go

0:20:33.120,0:20:37.360
to America and you ask for rye bread it's it's 
nothing like that. It might have some rye in it,

0:20:37.360,0:20:42.480
but it tastes sweet and it's really really 
hyper palatable. On on the subject of sweets,

0:20:42.480,0:20:46.627
so we we spoke about ultrarocessed foods. We 
understand that they cause inflammation. They

0:20:46.627,0:20:53.000
are really dangerous. And then you've got sugar 
as well. And there are things go out there that

0:20:53.000,0:20:59.080
say sugar causes cancer. Okay. Or inflammation. 
I don't Does it cause cancer or inflammation? I'm

0:20:59.080,0:21:04.160
not sure. So which one's almost the worst one? 
Is it sugar or is it I think you can sort of be

0:21:04.160,0:21:09.600
say I mean it's very simp because I find it on the 
internet. You know when I was researching for this

0:21:09.600,0:21:13.680
podcast I was saying what are people asking? 
What are the things that I see? What pops up?

0:21:13.680,0:21:18.560
We're looking at this. The team are picking out 
the things that the everyday person is asking. And

0:21:18.560,0:21:23.000
there are things like that sugar causes cancer. 
Don't eat sugar. It will give you cancer. Yeah,

0:21:23.000,0:21:26.520
that's what you see. You do see that and you see 
the same about ultrarocessed foods. And I should

0:21:26.520,0:21:30.880
say in their defense not every ultrarocessed 
food is a dangerous food. you know, anything

0:21:30.880,0:21:35.800
that contains some ultrarocessed ingredients 
isn't necessarily a bad food. And you can think

0:21:35.800,0:21:40.640
of examples, you know, people talk about obviously 
if you're thinking about a budget as well,

0:21:40.640,0:21:46.080
you you got to be careful because you could um be 
too ex sort of exclusive with this. I'm going to

0:21:46.080,0:21:51.480
eat ultrarocessed free and that's not accessible 
to the mainstream. And that's a worry for me

0:21:51.480,0:21:56.800
because healthy eating, you know, it should be 
accessible. We all admit that it's not entirely.

0:21:56.800,0:22:03.800
Um, but I think it's really important to think 
about whether again nuance ultrarocessed foods

0:22:03.800,0:22:09.760
that are the the worst culprits, the one that 
contain the the greatest number of additives

0:22:09.760,0:22:14.680
and the ones that are hyper palatable. And this 
is, you know, if you think about I had I had one

0:22:14.680,0:22:20.800
of my first ever clients um came to me and he was 
on a typical western diet and I sent him away with

0:22:20.800,0:22:26.640
a diet plan and he came back two weeks later and 
he just he said to me, "My jaw hurts. It hurts

0:22:26.640,0:22:32.320
from chewing. And I had a a moment of and this is 
before we even talked about ultrarocessed food. So

0:22:32.320,0:22:36.080
this is a moment of realization where I just think 
this guy wasn't even chewing his food before. He

0:22:36.080,0:22:42.120
was everything he was eating, you know, whether 
it's sort of burger burger buns or um burgers

0:22:42.120,0:22:47.960
or you know soft cooked chicken or fried softer 
they are the more red flagish it is. Yeah. So that

0:22:47.960,0:22:51.520
the more hyper palatable and that's one of the 
issues with ultrarocessed foods that we want to be

0:22:51.520,0:22:56.440
aware of is that they're very easy to eat more of 
them and they can be not for everyone but they can

0:22:56.440,0:23:01.000
be an addictive quality to them and I think that's 
what again some people are more prone to this than

0:23:01.000,0:23:05.600
others. So we shouldn't you know tar everyone 
on every food with the same brush. We should say

0:23:05.600,0:23:10.240
if you are somebody that when you eat you know 
say two biscuits you can't stop at two biscuits

0:23:10.240,0:23:14.680
and you want to eat five maybe the whole packet 
some people I've come across then you know that's

0:23:14.680,0:23:19.560
possibly an issue for you but it's not necessarily 
an issue for everybody but you could say the same

0:23:19.560,0:23:25.240
about sugar now sugar is very inflammatory and I 
think for years um we had the wall pulled over our

0:23:25.240,0:23:31.520
eyes as a as a a population because we thought for 
years that fat was the culprit and we recognized

0:23:31.520,0:23:35.880
that yes there are some bad fats and we do need 
to be careful not to consume too many, you know,

0:23:35.880,0:23:41.120
trans fats and not a diet too high in saturated 
fats. But there's some good quality saturated

0:23:41.120,0:23:45.840
fats. There's some good quality unsaturated fats. 
There are some good quality omega-3 fatty acids.

0:23:45.840,0:23:51.960
And we do need all of those in our diet. We do 
need those to survive. Sugar, we'll find it. If

0:23:51.960,0:23:57.600
you've took sugar off the table and we didn't eat 
another sugary thing in our lives, we would still

0:23:57.600,0:24:04.680
find enough sugar, if you like, nature sugar. What 
what did people do before we discovered the sugar

0:24:04.680,0:24:10.320
cane? Well, people, you know, at honey and they 
ate fruit. The human body does not need sugar.

0:24:10.320,0:24:15.400
So, we would be fine without it. We'd be perfectly 
fine without ultrarocessed foods. But both exist

0:24:15.400,0:24:19.120
in our modern diet and we just have to make 
better decisions according to what our body

0:24:19.120,0:24:23.080
does and how our body reacts to both. That's what 
I would say. And then you realize when you look at

0:24:23.080,0:24:30.160
sugar like the white granules how processed that 
is because um I had the privilege of tasting real

0:24:30.160,0:24:36.720
raw sugar cane as a kid and sucking it and you 
know it's really it's delicious. Looks nothing

0:24:36.720,0:24:42.160
like or tastes like sugar sugar. Yeah. And that 
that is the most refined form. And if you look at

0:24:42.160,0:24:47.720
any you know any brown sugar will have some 
element of it will be slightly more I'm not

0:24:47.720,0:24:52.080
saying it's nutritious slightly more nutritious 
because it will have minerals left in it like

0:24:52.080,0:24:56.680
you know molasses if you think of molasses that 
darkly syrup you know that's actually a source of

0:24:56.680,0:25:01.280
chromium and iron but we don't want to be eating 
spoonfuls of it but if you were going to put any

0:25:01.280,0:25:07.240
sort of syrup in something maybe that would be a 
better choice so it it is sadly nuanced okay okay

0:25:08.360,0:25:11.120
before I move on we'll go back to the 
breakfast lunch and dinner so just to

0:25:11.120,0:25:15.240
help everyone. Breakfast, lunch, dinner, and 
snack. Uh before we go there, you mentioned oil.

0:25:16.640,0:25:20.080
We've heard that olive oil is great, but then 
you got to be careful because some are just

0:25:20.080,0:25:24.080
for drizzling and if you use it for roasting 
that becomes cancerous because it can't get

0:25:24.080,0:25:27.880
you can't use it at such high temperatures. But 
then there's agree with actually I think you can

0:25:27.880,0:25:33.200
use you can use olive oil. It's self-protecting if 
you like the the levels of polyphenols in it are

0:25:33.200,0:25:38.000
protective. So I would say you can cook with 
olive oil and I would be perfectly happy to do

0:25:38.000,0:25:42.200
so. It's not a sustainable way for us to eat as a 
population. there were too many of us and too few

0:25:42.200,0:25:47.600
olive trees. We do need to be aware of that and 
consider that. Then we also need to think about,

0:25:47.600,0:25:51.240
you know, olive oil has been here since the 
Roman times. Again, there were far fewer of

0:25:51.240,0:25:55.840
fewer of us on the earth at that point. So, we do 
we just need to be aware that we do need to seek

0:25:55.840,0:26:02.000
other sources of oil. We can't all eat olive oil. 
Yeah. On on the oil though. So, there's olive oil,

0:26:02.000,0:26:07.160
there's all kinds of there's rape seed oil, 
there's sesame oil, there's all these oils,

0:26:07.160,0:26:12.800
and then there's vegetable oil. Is vegetable oil 
a processed food? Yes, it's a anything that's

0:26:12.800,0:26:17.360
been super refined like that we we shouldn't 
be consuming, you know, from an inflammation

0:26:17.360,0:26:21.640
perspective. If you do want to go down that path, 
and I suggest we do need to look, like I say,

0:26:21.640,0:26:27.640
beyond olive oil, then something like an extra 
virgin rape seed oil, a coldressed rap seed oil,

0:26:28.160,0:26:33.320
it's local. We grow lots of it here. and you 
know a cold pressed version rather than the

0:26:33.320,0:26:37.280
you know refined version that you will see in a 
lot of products in the supermarket because again

0:26:37.280,0:26:41.440
as soon as a manufacturer caught on to the fact 
that they can create something nice and cheaply

0:26:41.440,0:26:44.960
they'll put it in their food. Yeah, there's 
so much to to think about. Let's go back to

0:26:44.960,0:26:53.040
breakfast. How do we improve our breakfast? So 
think of it firstly as it could be any meal of the

0:26:53.040,0:26:58.600
day. So your breakfast doesn't have to be what we 
typically consider breakfast here in the UK. Um,

0:26:58.600,0:27:04.440
but I would say, you know, do think about fiber, 
which I think is it's very hot at the moment. It's

0:27:04.440,0:27:10.200
a hot topic at the moment. It'll have its day and 
it'll die down again. I I wish it didn't. I wish

0:27:10.200,0:27:16.160
it wouldn't. I don't think I think protein has had 
its day and people talk about protein still a bit.

0:27:16.160,0:27:22.600
Um, but I do think fiber is having its day right 
now. Um, fiber is a really important consideration

0:27:22.600,0:27:27.120
and it's harder now to get than it used to be. the 
way we used to grow our crops, the way we used to

0:27:27.120,0:27:31.120
prepare our food and the way we used to eat made 
it a whole lot easier to get fiber into our diet,

0:27:31.640,0:27:35.520
the way that we prepare our foods now, 
particularly ultrarocessed foods, that it's

0:27:35.520,0:27:41.080
it's it's almost impossible for a human being 
to get about 30 grams a day. Now, that's going

0:27:41.080,0:27:46.200
to vary according to male or female body size. 
30 grams. How visually what would 30 grams look

0:27:46.200,0:27:52.240
like? So, we're looking at say, for example, a 
kiwi fruit would be like uh 2 to three grams of

0:27:52.240,0:27:57.480
fiber. Gosh, really? What about a normal apple? 
standard size. Yeah. About four g, 5 g of fiber.

0:27:57.480,0:28:03.360
And we need 30. We we we are talking about having 
to make sure that now we have things like beans.

0:28:03.360,0:28:07.200
Um obviously the right kinds of fruits. 
Raspberries are a good choice when it

0:28:07.200,0:28:11.960
comes to fiber, but we also need to make sure 
that the grains that we have are whole grains.

0:28:11.960,0:28:16.080
Um we need to have seeds. We need to have nuts. 
You know, all of these things that we would have

0:28:16.080,0:28:23.200
had. I mean if you think about today the frequency 
with which we eat meat alone that there's an

0:28:23.200,0:28:28.120
opportunity cost to that you know so you know 
I'm not just talking about during the war here

0:28:28.120,0:28:33.000
in the UK but I'm talking about like in the 50s 
and 60s I'm talking about prior between the two

0:28:33.000,0:28:37.520
wars prior to that people couldn't afford to eat 
the amount of meat that we eat today the way we

0:28:37.520,0:28:42.560
produce it etc. So what did they eat instead? 
Well, there were a lot of pulses. You know,

0:28:42.560,0:28:46.840
pulses are cheap. They're a source of protein 
and they're a source of carbohydrate as well.

0:28:47.360,0:28:51.160
But they're a source of fiber, too. And I 
think, you know, where people used to sort of

0:28:51.720,0:28:56.480
piece pudding, for example, very old-fashioned, 
and I know often served alongside bacon, but

0:28:56.480,0:29:00.360
again, that bacon wouldn't have been prepared in 
a factory. It would have been prepared, you know,

0:29:00.360,0:29:05.680
or even a ham or a ham hawk. would have been 
prepared by your butcher locally and it wouldn't

0:29:05.680,0:29:10.480
have the additives that we have in our modern 
day baking bacon cuz it would have been smoked,

0:29:10.480,0:29:15.360
you know. So, so our preparation techniques 
have changed. I appreciate I'm going off on

0:29:15.360,0:29:19.160
one now and I completely forgotten the question. 
No, no, I also [laughter] forgot the question cuz

0:29:20.560,0:29:23.960
I'm supposed I'm supposed to remember 
the question. But it's so interesting.

0:29:23.960,0:29:26.760
I've forgotten because you just Yeah, 
you're making me think a lot. I mean,

0:29:26.760,0:29:31.200
even the process of smoking something, you 
can smoke it with chemicals added in or you

0:29:31.200,0:29:38.240
can smoke it naturally without those chemicals. I 
just feel like, you know, it makes it's upsetting

0:29:38.240,0:29:44.560
to know what's happened to the food industry. It's 
horrible that we've all that we're eating disease.

0:29:44.560,0:29:50.120
It's horrible. And we need to have these podcasts 
and we need to put that information out there

0:29:50.880,0:29:57.760
and we need to reprogram all of our minds and 
get away. I don't like the marketing that's

0:29:58.440,0:30:03.560
marketing things that are dangerous 
for people. Those products need to stop

0:30:03.560,0:30:08.600
Yeah. existing. It's I would love to see it's a 
different labeling system because I appreciate,

0:30:08.600,0:30:13.040
you know, businesses want to make money, but 
I think if things were labeled differently,

0:30:13.040,0:30:18.120
people eating the I eat ultrarocessed foods. 
I'm not completely, you know, immune to that.

0:30:18.120,0:30:23.280
I'm going to find myself traveling somewhere, 
abroad, somewhere. I'm going to grab something,

0:30:23.280,0:30:28.443
but I wouldn't make it the main part of my diet. 
I'd say my diet is probably 90 to 95% ultra

0:30:28.443,0:30:33.720
process free because I make a conscious effort for 
that to be the case. Okay. Right. Right. Okay. So,

0:30:34.280,0:30:40.640
breakfast, we've got our Yeah. We our breakfast 
looks more like dinner. And we've got in there, we

0:30:40.640,0:30:45.760
try and packing pack it with fiber. We've got our 
protein. And if we think about how little fiber

0:30:45.760,0:30:50.600
there is in fruit, we need to bring in beans, 
pulses, and those kind of things. Yeah. To up that

0:30:50.600,0:30:54.280
fiber level. Yeah, there are other I mean there 
are certain fruits that are about I've mentioned

0:30:55.120,0:30:59.480
kiwi and raspberry great. Um but you know there 
are some like gems that people don't necessarily

0:30:59.480,0:31:03.880
recognize like desicated coconut that's actually 
relatively high in fiber. Just popping that onto

0:31:03.880,0:31:10.440
your porridge in the morning. I also have like 
how do you buy that in a can? Yeah, the dried one.

0:31:10.440,0:31:14.000
And what about the liquid one? You put that into 
curries coconut milk. Yeah, you can get that. I

0:31:14.000,0:31:18.160
mean that's not going to have as much um but the 
desiccated. So this is the you know the actual

0:31:18.160,0:31:22.440
meat of a coconut that's being powdery. It looks 
looks like it can be that or you can have the

0:31:22.440,0:31:26.720
toasted you bits pieces that have been toasted. So 
there's even more flavor from those and those are

0:31:26.720,0:31:31.920
delicious on you know again yogurt. So you can 
make a savory version of yogurt you can make a

0:31:31.920,0:31:36.640
sweet version. I think I sort of split or divided 
people the other day because I suggested putting

0:31:36.640,0:31:40.440
yogurt on toast which is something I started 
doing at university and it's very Middle Eastern

0:31:41.000,0:31:46.560
but it's a really good combination especially if 
you've got whole grain toast. And I use I I use um

0:31:46.560,0:31:50.200
chia seeds quite a lot which I know you know 
people talk a lot again they're having their

0:31:50.200,0:31:55.600
day but if you want to make a jam and you don't 
want to have a sugary jam just get a little bit

0:31:55.600,0:32:01.520
of fruit and some chia seeds and you know you just 
boil the fruit down till it's reduced add the chia

0:32:01.520,0:32:06.160
seeds and it thickens up beautifully and you've 
got a great combination of you know the sweetness

0:32:06.160,0:32:11.760
the natural carbohydrates and the fiber and the 
protein from the chia seeds plus the yogurt good

0:32:12.320,0:32:17.480
slice of toast that's a great hungry. You're 
making me hungry. Okay, we've had our breakfast.

0:32:17.480,0:32:23.120
We we go to work. What are we snacking on? So, 
ideally, you know, we would not have to snack.

0:32:23.120,0:32:27.800
You know, again, our bodies tend to do better when 
we don't. Now, there there are differences between

0:32:27.800,0:32:33.400
hyperactive, hyperactive, [laughter] hyperact, 
very busy people, people that are very active

0:32:33.400,0:32:38.240
will require more frequent uh meals. And 
especially I've worked with a lot of athletes,

0:32:38.240,0:32:43.640
that's how I got into nutrition is through sport. 
So I I I totally get that you need to prepare for

0:32:43.640,0:32:48.000
and you need to recover afterwards. So there are 
going to be different rules for different people,

0:32:48.000,0:32:53.000
but by and large most of us should be able to go 
between meals without without anything without

0:32:53.000,0:32:58.920
eating. We shouldn't need to snack. And again, you 
know, I talk a lot I have a degree in geography as

0:32:58.920,0:33:03.760
well and I talk a lot about place because I think 
it's really important to look at other places

0:33:03.760,0:33:09.840
and you know I don't think the UK necessarily 
gets this part right. We're we're brilliant at

0:33:09.840,0:33:15.440
some things. We're amazing at sarcasm and we're 
world leaders at irony, but I don't think our food

0:33:15.440,0:33:21.040
culture has been the best. And I do think when 
we look to other nations, we can learn a lot.

0:33:21.040,0:33:25.040
We don't have to look very far. Like, you 
know, I always think about the Scandinavians

0:33:25.040,0:33:30.080
and, you know, how much more healthy they seem to 
be despite the fact that they don't get enough sun

0:33:30.080,0:33:36.440
um when it comes to omega-3 and vitamin D status 
because they actually consume the oily fish that's

0:33:36.440,0:33:42.240
in the waters around them. We're a tiny island. 
We're surrounded by water and so many of us don't

0:33:42.240,0:33:49.880
eat any fish and most of us don't eat any oily 
fish. So, well, my husband I'm married to a Brit

0:33:49.880,0:33:55.080
and he said that actually growing up they used to 
eat more fish. So, now for breakfast and there's

0:33:55.080,0:34:01.880
another one which is kind of a yellow one. I don't 
know the name now but uh kippers. Kippers. Yes.

0:34:01.880,0:34:07.120
So, that was more of a breakfast, right? Yes. 
Exactly. So, why did that go out of fashion? I I

0:34:07.120,0:34:10.840
I have no idea. There's all sorts of things. We 
used to eat nose totail. We used to eat the whole

0:34:10.840,0:34:15.760
animal. You know, I I only have to spend time 
with my 85year-old mother to see her eating,

0:34:15.760,0:34:22.760
you know, tripe and um ox tongue and you know that 
may offend some people and I'm sorry if it does,

0:34:22.760,0:34:25.720
but the reality is if you're going to some 
people are going to eat beef and they're going

0:34:25.720,0:34:29.160
to eat steak, but they're not going to think 
about what happened to the rest of the animal.

0:34:29.160,0:34:33.800
The rest of the animal is only going to go to 
waste. So, should we not go back to practices?

0:34:34.440,0:34:40.320
I know. And you know someone like my dad also very 
very traditional he'll boil it is it is the whole

0:34:40.320,0:34:46.320
animal and to some it might be freaky but yes 
there's zero waste absolutely zero waste. Yeah and

0:34:46.320,0:34:50.480
that and that is where we've become removed 
um you know I know there have been times when

0:34:51.360,0:34:57.480
you know famous TV chefs have taken children to 
farms and you know had a lot of um negative press

0:34:57.480,0:35:02.280
where they've shown children actually what happens 
and how it happens. But quite frankly, I'm I'm for

0:35:02.280,0:35:07.040
children understanding where their food comes 
from. Otherwise, it just gets delivered to them on

0:35:07.040,0:35:11.960
the table. They have no connection with it. They 
have no relationship with it. And we do we have

0:35:11.960,0:35:16.360
an epidemic of fussy eating right now. And I'm 
not suggesting that's the only reason for it. But

0:35:16.360,0:35:22.200
I do think having children educated in how foods 
where they come from and how they how they make

0:35:22.200,0:35:27.560
it to the table is a huge part. And I don't think 
it's up to schools. I really don't. And adults.

0:35:27.560,0:35:34.040
Yeah. May I [laughter] may I add? Okay. So, try 
and avoid the snacking and obviously grab the

0:35:34.040,0:35:40.760
the food that's originated from its source without 
the label. Lunch. Yeah. What could we go for? Good

0:35:40.760,0:35:46.600
question. So, again, you know, our our typical 
meal deal throws us off the scent. If we think

0:35:46.600,0:35:49.880
that's an actual meal and that's going to keep 
us going, you know, some people are having lunch

0:35:49.880,0:35:53.880
at 12:00 and they're not going to get home till 
8. Yeah. That that's when you're going to snack

0:35:53.880,0:35:58.360
because that lunch is not going to do it for you. 
The typical meal deal being a packet of crisps,

0:35:58.360,0:36:03.360
a sandwich, and possibly something sweet 
or a fizzy drink. So, if we look at that,

0:36:03.360,0:36:06.520
you know, if we break that down nutritionally, 
you've got an awful lot of carbohydrates,

0:36:06.520,0:36:10.760
you've got very little protein, you've probably 
got no fiber at all. That is not going to be a

0:36:10.760,0:36:14.400
sustaining meal. And quite frankly, if you're 
looking at achieving certain things, you know,

0:36:14.400,0:36:18.760
and I do think the younger generation are more 
aware of what, you know, their macros are, what

0:36:18.760,0:36:23.280
their goals are. They know that they want to get a 
certain amount of fiber, maybe not so much fiber,

0:36:23.280,0:36:27.880
maybe that's where they need to look at it, but 
protein and carbohydrates and so on and so forth,

0:36:27.880,0:36:32.440
but that meal in the middle of the day, it just 
isn't going to do it for anybody. And therefore,

0:36:32.440,0:36:36.440
there's an opportunity cost because you've got 
the rest of the day to try and make up for it.

0:36:36.440,0:36:40.480
Even greater focus on that breakfast and even 
greater focus on that evening meal. But what

0:36:40.480,0:36:45.440
if that lunchtime meal was as important 
as the other two? Or if you're somebody,

0:36:45.440,0:36:50.160
and again I know people that only have two meals 
a day because that works brilliantly for them,

0:36:50.160,0:36:55.200
sort of an intermittent fasting type thing. 
Um, again, even more focused on those two

0:36:55.200,0:36:59.720
meals. They've got to be absolutely right. You 
know, you've really got to focus on that. So,

0:36:59.720,0:37:04.880
your typical British meal deal isn't going to do 
it for you. You do need to seek out alternatives

0:37:04.880,0:37:09.040
and and honestly, the quickest thing is just 
prepare more of what you did the night before and

0:37:09.040,0:37:14.680
take that to work the next day. It's the quickest, 
easiest. go back to a lunch box, take your lunch,

0:37:14.680,0:37:19.280
buy a thermos flask. There's a squat thermos flask 
that you can buy. We have about five of them at

0:37:19.280,0:37:24.040
home and you know, my husband's on a road trip 
at the moment. He took one with him. He took the

0:37:24.040,0:37:29.200
night before supper with him. And you know, he's 
honestly stopping at a service station and having,

0:37:29.200,0:37:34.320
you know, this lovely stew rather than having what 
was on offer at the service station was. Yeah.

0:37:34.320,0:37:40.400
It's really upsetting these service stations. 
It is. It's just it upsets me. Okay. So you you

0:37:40.400,0:37:46.160
think about preparing and you take your lunch with 
you because you you won't be able to cook and and

0:37:46.160,0:37:50.400
whatever you grab you're limited. So well there 
are going to be better choices at work as well.

0:37:50.400,0:37:56.280
You know the people will have like what like 
what I would prioritize protein at lunchtime

0:37:56.280,0:38:00.960
because if you eat too many carbohydrates you're 
going to get very sleepy. So I would think about

0:38:00.960,0:38:06.520
going to you know whatever is around you. 
Is there a bean soup that you can choose?

0:38:06.520,0:38:11.400
Is there some falafel? Is there some hummus? You 
know, some people are absolutely they they've not

0:38:11.400,0:38:17.000
got time to go and seek out something, but they 
can go and get some hummus and like a carrot even

0:38:17.000,0:38:22.000
or like some apple wedges. What about like a 
chicken salad from Gales? Great. Perfect. I

0:38:22.000,0:38:24.880
thought you were going to go no. Oh, no. No. You 
know, places [laughter] like that, but you know

0:38:26.320,0:38:30.640
that is going to cost you at least. It is going 
to cost you. Yeah. And most places are going to

0:38:30.640,0:38:34.960
charge you something like that. So, and Mark 
Spencers or whatever, sainsburries, a chicken

0:38:34.960,0:38:39.240
salad. Yeah. chicken salad would be a better 
option, but for most people that's not going to

0:38:39.240,0:38:43.680
give them even enough that and again there's 
a mental element to this because you sort of

0:38:43.680,0:38:46.560
if you've grown up with a sandwich and 
a packet of crisp in your lunch box,

0:38:46.560,0:38:50.480
you sort of think of that as lunch. So you have to 
change the way you you look at it. But certainly,

0:38:50.480,0:38:55.840
yeah, prioritize protein at lunchtime. Make sure 
that you've got some vegetables in there. Um don't

0:38:55.840,0:39:01.920
stress too much, but don't think of it as a sort 
of cheat meal. Think of it as an important meal.

0:39:01.920,0:39:07.240
Give it due credit important meal. Yeah, it's 
important as as breakfast and it's kind of like

0:39:07.240,0:39:13.880
dismissed lunch. It's not really given [laughter] 
value to and we don't even you know it was 2021 I

0:39:13.880,0:39:20.040
think it was that in France um they finally 
scrapped the law that made it illegal to eat

0:39:20.040,0:39:26.120
at your desk. So up until 2021 the only reason 
they scrapped the law was because of COVID.

0:39:26.120,0:39:31.000
So if you think about the French eating culture 
they've always made time for lunch. you you leave

0:39:31.000,0:39:36.720
regardless. My one of my uh my brother-in-laws, he 
lives in France, uh he's a painter and decorator

0:39:36.720,0:39:41.160
and at lunchtime they down tools and they sit 
and sometimes wherever they're working they

0:39:41.160,0:39:45.720
get vouch like lunch and vouchers. They can go 
and get a meal and they sit with their workmates

0:39:45.720,0:39:49.880
and they eat properly. They're not even having a 
sandwich, you know, they're having a proper meal

0:39:49.880,0:39:54.640
and so the French really know a thing or two 
and that eating alesco, we have a phrase for

0:39:54.640,0:40:00.320
it here so it's so unhygienic. But anyway, um, but 
you know, I lived in Portugal for 2 and 1/2 years

0:40:00.320,0:40:07.160
and same thing. And we would take out an hour 
and a half and all go the whole office downstairs

0:40:07.160,0:40:13.320
cafeteria and have proper like fish, potatoes, 
everything. Yeah. Think about the communication

0:40:13.320,0:40:18.040
that goes on during that lunch hour. I bet people 
are much more efficient, more effective. I mean,

0:40:18.040,0:40:21.360
I'm sure you've had guests on here that have said 
how much more effective and efficient people are

0:40:21.360,0:40:25.360
when they take breaks during the day. I always 
used to laugh when you used to have, you know,

0:40:25.360,0:40:30.480
the the smoking policy. The most efficient people 
were the smokers because they got to go outside,

0:40:30.480,0:40:34.200
have a cigarette, come back in, they got a mental 
break, and those mental smokers just worked,

0:40:34.200,0:40:37.840
worked, work worked, work work, but they 
became inefficient in their working practices.

0:40:37.840,0:40:42.080
And I'd say the same with lunch. If you don't 
stop and make it an entity in its own right,

0:40:42.080,0:40:46.240
you're missing a trick. You're just going to work 
yourself into an early grave because, you know,

0:40:46.240,0:40:50.680
your body is not going to thank you for that 
at any stage. You do need to take breaks. And

0:40:50.680,0:40:55.880
eating whilst you're relaxed will help with your 
digestion. A lot of people end up with, you know,

0:40:55.880,0:40:58.840
in the afternoon particularly if they've rushed 
their lunch or they've eaten a lunch that's sort

0:40:58.840,0:41:02.240
of substandard or they've eaten at their desk 
when they haven't been focused on what they're

0:41:02.240,0:41:06.640
doing because they've been distracted by an email 
that's come in. Their digestion will be really

0:41:06.640,0:41:10.120
struggling. Their whole digestive system will be 
really struggling. A lot of people think they have

0:41:10.120,0:41:15.280
IBS when actually it's just because they haven't 
made time for lunch. They haven't made time for

0:41:15.280,0:41:20.840
lunch. We need to respect our lunch more. Okay. 
Yeah. I love that. I never thought about lunch

0:41:20.840,0:41:27.680
in that way ever. Well, now, right, dinner. 
Is it the most important one or is breakfast

0:41:27.680,0:41:31.720
still the most important one? Again, it depends 
on who you are. Um, because you know that that

0:41:31.720,0:41:36.400
sort of lark mentality is like breakfast is my 
number one thing. It's like I I almost go to bed

0:41:36.400,0:41:40.200
the night before dreaming of my breakfast, which 
some people might think of as weird, particularly

0:41:40.200,0:41:44.400
if they're not breakfast people, and the last 
thing they feel like is eating breakfast. um

0:41:44.400,0:41:48.360
that evening [clears throat] meal it it is often 
a time when particularly families or partners will

0:41:48.360,0:41:53.800
come together. So I would say it's more of um 
it has more importance in terms of its sort of

0:41:53.800,0:41:58.880
bringing together of people. However, I think 
what people these days probably end up feeling

0:41:58.880,0:42:04.000
it has importance for is because the rest of the 
day has been a bit of a miss and you need to hit

0:42:04.000,0:42:09.320
this something unhealthy for breakfast. You've had 
a sandwich for lunch at your computer and you've

0:42:09.320,0:42:13.760
landed at dinner. Exactly. What am I going to make 
now? What have I and you're too tired to cook.

0:42:13.760,0:42:17.400
You're too tired to cook and and you've got half 
an hour. What do you do? Well, there's some great

0:42:17.400,0:42:21.600
companies out there that are doing these meal 
kits, but again, it's almost like uh you know,

0:42:21.600,0:42:27.360
they they know that there are going to be people 
who are in this situation. I I see where I live,

0:42:27.360,0:42:31.200
I see a lot of those boxes out on 
recycling day. So, I know a lot of

0:42:31.200,0:42:35.360
people, you know, that work or they've got 
family or both and and they use those kits,

0:42:35.360,0:42:39.680
meal kits where they're making it, you know, 
according to a recipe. That's one option. You

0:42:39.680,0:42:43.640
know, the second option is that you do quite 
a good job at batch cooking. Um, and again,

0:42:43.640,0:42:48.120
there's some brilliant resources online where 
you can batch cook, where you can prepare meals

0:42:48.120,0:42:52.640
that are uncooked, freeze them, and then 
take them out and pop them straight into the

0:42:52.640,0:42:57.000
just just on that, you've written how many 
books? Seven. Seven. You've written seven books.

0:42:57.000,0:43:00.960
And one of your books or several of the 
books go through well, there's different

0:43:00.960,0:43:05.640
things that you can use to prepare these meals, 
but what's the simplest of the books just for like

0:43:05.640,0:43:11.120
the simplest meals? Um, which would you recommend 
for really for busy people that just want to

0:43:11.120,0:43:16.080
probably sheet pan dinners. Sheet pan. Sheet pan 
dinners. Yeah. So, that was one of my first books.

0:43:16.080,0:43:22.200
Okay. And it the concept is you put everything 
onto one tray and then you pop it in the oven.

0:43:22.200,0:43:26.640
Now, there might be things that you add partway 
through. Broccoli might take less time to cook

0:43:26.640,0:43:30.160
than the chicken breast, for example. So, you add 
that a little bit further along the line, but it

0:43:30.160,0:43:37.640
is a one tray dinner and just put it on or Yeah. 
Yeah. I think that's a really easy way to cook and

0:43:37.640,0:43:43.560
it's it's a simple way because well a there's less 
washing up and I I don't know when I speak to to

0:43:43.560,0:43:47.520
friends you know often it's one person cooks and 
the other one washes up. Well if the one person

0:43:47.520,0:43:51.000
that's cooking is putting it on one tray and the 
one person washing up is washing up one tray that

0:43:51.000,0:43:56.320
seems like a fairly not a lot to ask. Yeah. Okay. 
And you've put together really easy, really simple

0:43:57.200,0:44:01.760
food dinners that we can just really really 
simple. I think it's often a sort of a

0:44:01.760,0:44:07.920
misunderstanding that like I'm a chef. I'm not. 
I'm a cook and I want to find ways that are quick

0:44:07.920,0:44:13.169
and easy to cook from scratch but without using 
ultrarocessed foods. My husband is the process

0:44:13.169,0:44:18.080
driven one. He loves the whole sourdough thing. 
That's right up the street. Takes too long. I'm

0:44:18.080,0:44:21.680
not for that. That's why I use a pressure cooker 
rather than a slow cooker. We're going to get into

0:44:21.680,0:44:27.560
the equipment, but basically just so because we're 
we're trying to help people and people like me,

0:44:27.560,0:44:33.240
I'm guilty. I'm not. [laughter] So So we'll put 
the the links in the descriptions below. Yeah.

0:44:34.080,0:44:39.680
So, it's easy. You go in, you do that. Boom, 
boom, boom. Okay, let's go into equipment. Um,

0:44:39.680,0:44:43.200
and also we're going to go into shopping because 
you need to have the stuff in your house and

0:44:43.200,0:44:49.520
shopping can be a real pain as well and it takes a 
lot of time. [laughter] Okay, so right, equipment

0:44:49.520,0:44:55.240
besides an oven. What else do you need? I 
love an air fryer because it's like a quick

0:44:55.240,0:45:00.560
oven. Uh, if there are just sort of two of you, 
great. If there's a much larger number, having an

0:45:00.560,0:45:05.240
air fryer can get difficult unless you are doing 
those one like the air fryers just because it it

0:45:05.240,0:45:10.080
heats up really quickly. A lot of um modern ovens 
do, but slightly older ovens and it doesn't take

0:45:10.080,0:45:15.880
you to go much further than 5 years back. They can 
take some of them like 10 15 minutes to warm up,

0:45:15.880,0:45:20.480
whereas an air fryer tends to take about 2 minutes 
um to warm up. So, it's quick and easy from that

0:45:20.480,0:45:25.360
perspective. And I think that is sometimes an 
obstacle to people cooking from scratch. the

0:45:25.360,0:45:28.960
time it takes to warm up the oven is an obstacle 
because people get home and they're absolutely

0:45:28.960,0:45:34.400
ravenous and they just want to eat. So that's one 
less thing to worry about. So I love having an air

0:45:34.400,0:45:38.520
fryer, but but honestly it doesn't matter if you 
don't have one because there is the oven and you

0:45:38.520,0:45:42.440
you know if you're thinking about equipment in our 
British kitchens which are not that big and you've

0:45:42.440,0:45:46.920
got unlimited amount of surface space, I would 
say a pressure cooker multi cooker. I'm going to

0:45:46.920,0:45:51.240
call it a multi cooker because that's what it is. 
You know, there are some big brands on the market.

0:45:51.240,0:45:56.760
I I still think they're an undervalued bit of 
kit. I just I I wish more people knew about

0:45:56.760,0:46:00.920
them. Really? Yeah. I I've never even considered 
a pressure cooker. You'll see again you'll see

0:46:00.920,0:46:06.760
a lot in India where there are a lot of pulses 
prepared and going into meals. You know, there's

0:46:06.760,0:46:11.360
a lot of vegetarians and a lot of vegetarian 
food in India and a lot of those dishes will be

0:46:11.360,0:46:16.920
based around beans and pulses and preparing those 
where you don't buy a can every time. Actually,

0:46:16.920,0:46:21.160
preparing them from scratch makes them much more 
easily digested. Some people get quite flatulent

0:46:21.160,0:46:25.760
when they eat beans. Cooking them in a pressure 
cooker makes them much more easily digested and

0:46:25.760,0:46:29.520
less flatulence, which is good. [snorts] 
So that's what I do. I prepare them from

0:46:29.520,0:46:33.640
scratch in the pressure cooker and then I actually 
prepare them and then put them into the freezer in

0:46:33.640,0:46:37.480
the portion sizes you get cans because I know 
a lot of people haven't got a pressure cooker.

0:46:37.480,0:46:41.240
So, you know, but I just wish more people 
did because I think it would be great for

0:46:41.240,0:46:45.840
rotos. How is a pressure cooker better than 
an oven? I mean, how does it work? I don't

0:46:45.840,0:46:51.280
even know much about Yeah. So it basically sort 
of like forces a bit like um if you think about

0:46:51.280,0:46:55.240
slow cook slow cookers what they do you know 
like if you think about you can take a sort of

0:46:55.240,0:46:59.520
a cheaper cut of meat and you know by the time 
it's cooked for hours on a really slow heat you

0:46:59.520,0:47:04.240
can sort of tear apart. So you can do all of that 
with a pressure cooker but you can do it obviously

0:47:04.880,0:47:10.120
much more quickly and the same with things like 
rice. I mean the multi cooker it basically is also

0:47:10.120,0:47:15.480
a rice cooker. The guy that developed it is of an 
Asian origin. And he wanted it to be able to do

0:47:15.480,0:47:20.400
meat and rice that also does make yogurts and 
other things. But let's not over complicate

0:47:20.400,0:47:24.520
it. Yeah. If you want, you know, a dish and you've 
got some, you want some brown rice, cooks brown

0:47:24.520,0:47:29.840
rice perfectly. If you've got some pork belly 
and you want great flavor pork belly, you can

0:47:29.840,0:47:34.880
cook that. A whole chicken, you could cook a whole 
chicken in there. I cook chicken from frozen in

0:47:34.880,0:47:40.440
my pressure cooker and it's entirely safe to eat. 
And that is a game changer because if you've like

0:47:40.440,0:47:46.200
run out of everything, you know, and you've got 
really very little in, I can take some frozen veg

0:47:46.200,0:47:52.080
like I always keep a combination of frozen onion, 
celery, and carrot. So it's called soprito, meua,

0:47:52.080,0:47:56.440
base vegetables. It's called different things in 
different cultures, but you use that as a base

0:47:56.440,0:48:01.040
of pretty much anything. You can get some garlic 
and some ginger in there if you want to make it

0:48:01.040,0:48:05.640
slightly one way oriented or the other. And then 
you can just pop in your chicken and some sort of

0:48:05.640,0:48:10.080
sauce. You know, it could be a tin of tomatoes. It 
could be tin of tomatoes and some herbs. It could

0:48:10.080,0:48:14.840
be your coconut milk if you want to make more of 
a Thai curry. And then you just cook it until it

0:48:14.840,0:48:18.600
and it literally is pulled apart by the time you 
bring it out of the pressure cooker. People don't

0:48:18.600,0:48:22.400
people don't know this. And I think people are 
scared because it's not a technique we would have

0:48:22.400,0:48:26.280
learned growing up. We have our ovens and and 
it's can I just ask go back go back to the

0:48:26.280,0:48:30.320
tins. So if we're buying the tinned beans and 
the tinned tomatoes and the tinned whatever,

0:48:30.320,0:48:34.280
is that okay or is that ultrarocessed and we're 
worrying about that? Some people talk about the

0:48:34.280,0:48:38.800
lining in the the tins and whether that is 
going to be if it's something acidic in the

0:48:38.800,0:48:44.880
can or the tin. It can lead the lining to be, 
you know, for the tomato and for the beans. And

0:48:45.640,0:48:50.640
again, I I would say, you know, my reason for 
cooking the beans is because it helps me to digest

0:48:50.640,0:48:54.080
them. It helps the whole family to digest them. 
They're they're lower in what we call fitates,

0:48:54.080,0:48:58.640
which are the anti. So, basically, buy it in a 
packet. I I think so, but like I totally get that

0:48:58.640,0:49:01.640
people aren't going to have time to prepare their 
beans, and I don't want that to be a reason that

0:49:01.640,0:49:06.160
people don't eat beans. So, if you need to buy 
cans, buy cans. So, how many times a week should

0:49:06.160,0:49:10.640
you be eating beans? Oh gosh, that's a really 
good question. I don't, again, it depends on the

0:49:10.640,0:49:16.240
individual, but I would say, you know, most of us 
could have could add some beans or some lentils to

0:49:16.240,0:49:20.880
like I [snorts] don't know, four or five dishes 
in our evenings, our evening meals, but salads,

0:49:20.880,0:49:25.600
you know, again, it's a bit of a social media 
thing at the moment, but a dense bean salad,

0:49:25.600,0:49:30.200
they're all over social media. And you know, great 
that people are finally embracing, you know, this

0:49:30.200,0:49:34.160
humbled little thing, the bean that's so cheap. Do 
you know, my mother-in-law made something really

0:49:34.160,0:49:38.840
nice the other day and I I just I started eating 
and I almost couldn't stop. I think that it had

0:49:38.840,0:49:45.560
nutrients of everything that I wanted. She made 
these big white beans in a salad with tuna with

0:49:45.560,0:49:51.480
chopped onion and some sort of sauce. And I tell 
you, I love that combination. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:49:51.480,0:49:56.760
Right up my stop eating it. Yeah. Wonder what it 
was in there that I needed so much. But honestly,

0:49:56.760,0:50:01.480
you make a really good point there. You're 
listening to your body and and and very often

0:50:01.480,0:50:06.480
when we listen to our bodies, our bodies will tell 
us exactly what we need. You know, I know a lot

0:50:06.480,0:50:11.840
of women will say at certain time, you know, in 
their cycle, they will crave certain foods more.

0:50:11.840,0:50:15.680
There's a good reason for that, and we probably 
know what that is. But, you know, I I certainly

0:50:15.680,0:50:19.840
understand that we listen, I think, more to social 
media than we listen to our bodies these days.

0:50:19.840,0:50:25.720
And I really really urge people to just tune in 
to your own body because your body will tell you

0:50:25.720,0:50:30.040
a huge amount. And the food that we then 
subsequently put in is the message back up

0:50:30.040,0:50:34.360
back to our body. I got you, kid. I understand 
what you're saying, you know, thanks. You know,

0:50:34.360,0:50:39.640
so so it's it is a two-way process and we do need 
to listen. You're speaking about Scandinavians

0:50:39.640,0:50:46.560
as well. So I'm Polish and we just you know 
across the the body of water the Swedes eat

0:50:46.560,0:50:51.840
a lot of herring and we as Polish people also 
eat a lot of herring and we also Polish women

0:50:51.840,0:50:57.000
eat herring when pregnant now it's a we say don't 
eat raw fish but throughout all my pregnancies I

0:50:57.000,0:51:02.200
could not stop eating herring really important for 
brain development as a baby so much herring yeah

0:51:02.200,0:51:06.240
and people again I think we we in this country 
we're taught to supplement and we're taught

0:51:06.240,0:51:12.120
particularly to supplement folic acid so B9 But 
omega-3 is hugely important for the development

0:51:12.120,0:51:17.880
of a baby's brain. Um, so all pregnant women 
should crave that like there was no tomorrow.

0:51:18.800,0:51:24.520
You probably got very brainy children. [laughter] 
They actually are. There you go. Caring. That's

0:51:24.520,0:51:29.720
your key. It was the food. But yeah, I just 
remember that kind of the feeling of of of

0:51:29.720,0:51:35.480
uh Yeah. I just couldn't get enough. Yeah. 
Yeah. So, um I mean the main takeaways here

0:51:35.480,0:51:42.920
are that we buy whole, we plan ahead, we we 
strip it down to the most essential things.

0:51:43.560,0:51:49.560
And you know, when you think of a recipe book and 
going into that, that also seems like work. So,

0:51:49.560,0:51:54.400
I mean, how does one that doesn't normally 
cook or have the time for it and find it a bit

0:51:54.400,0:51:59.480
scary, how can you step into the world of I mean, 
what do you do? Do you open up page one and go,

0:52:00.160,0:52:04.200
I'm doing that. And then and then what I asked 
earlier, how do you shop for that? Do you have

0:52:04.200,0:52:09.040
to check the recipe first? Then I know I'm asking 
really basic questions in a way and they sound

0:52:09.040,0:52:13.880
basic whilst asking, but even for myself, I'm 
going to go shopping. I'm probably going to go to

0:52:13.880,0:52:20.440
Tesco and I'm going to buy my usual thing. So what 
what do you do? I would sit down if you can once a

0:52:20.440,0:52:26.840
week and think about a meal plan for the week. for 
the week if you can do it because it's one bit of

0:52:26.840,0:52:33.360
effort you know but it will reap great rewards. So 
if if there's time an hour you know at the weekend

0:52:33.360,0:52:37.920
maybe yeah there's enough from scrolling you can 
delete some of the Exactly. Take an hour out of

0:52:37.920,0:52:45.000
that. Let's be real but don't make it too big 
a goal. So you say you buy your usuals. So then

0:52:45.000,0:52:49.880
think about one meal that's different from your 
usual. I mean actually again growing up we had

0:52:49.880,0:52:55.360
about a three-week rotation. So mom would do the 
if it was Tuesday week three it was always going

0:52:55.360,0:53:01.720
to be spag bowl and if it was Thursday week two it 
was always going to be stew you know so we kind of

0:53:01.720,0:53:06.600
knew by what day it was obviously not the case in 
our house but I know it works for a lot of people

0:53:06.600,0:53:10.520
but just plan what you're going to have and don't 
make it that different from what you do currently

0:53:10.520,0:53:15.000
change one meal and then change two meals and 
then change three meals and do it week on week

0:53:15.000,0:53:19.800
so it's nothing too big and nothing too ownorous. 
Also, if you've got children and you're starting

0:53:19.800,0:53:23.560
to feed them new stuff, they might be a bit 
funny about that because they've got very

0:53:23.560,0:53:27.360
used to what they're having and anything that's 
different or odd can seem quite threatening.

0:53:27.880,0:53:33.160
I try and sneak in liver into their spaghetti 
bolognese. I like that. Is there liver in this?

0:53:33.160,0:53:37.920
Oh, they can actually taste it. Shame. [laughter] 
Yeah, I know. I tried to conceal it and I chopped

0:53:37.920,0:53:43.040
up fresh chilies and I disguise and everything, 
but they always know. Yeah, I know a lot of people

0:53:43.040,0:53:46.840
put and and you know, I've done it, but I don't 
tend to do it as a standard, but they put um

0:53:46.840,0:53:53.200
lentils, brown lentils into their either their 
chili into their minced meat. Um a it's a cost

0:53:53.200,0:53:57.280
saving, but also b it's a chance to get more 
fiber in there. So, they'll, you know, sort of

0:53:57.840,0:54:02.200
uh supplement the the beef a little bit with 
some of the sort of pentils or brown lentils.

0:54:03.440,0:54:07.280
That sounds like Yeah. So it really sounds sounds 
like you're pushing the beans and the lentil

0:54:07.280,0:54:12.480
lentils and those [laughter] you're bringing them 
in cuz it's a and those are really rich in fiber.

0:54:12.480,0:54:19.080
Those are the ones and fiber is that essential 
to preventing colon cancer because colon cancer

0:54:19.080,0:54:25.160
is on the rise. So I'm just I just want to so so 
be beyond that this is about everyone's systems

0:54:25.160,0:54:29.520
working well and we talk about from a digestive 
perspective but it's also about you again if we

0:54:29.520,0:54:34.400
look at what's happened with people's cholesterol 
levels there is this thing called familial hyper

0:54:34.400,0:54:39.120
cholesterolmia that's where families you know pass 
from generation to generation high cholesterol

0:54:39.120,0:54:44.240
but so many people think they've got that when 
actually it's it's lifestyle and diet related

0:54:44.240,0:54:49.200
and it's really important to start looking at how 
you make those changes and fiber is the key change

0:54:49.200,0:54:54.680
really. But but but if we get it in from the word 
go, you know, if our children when you're weaning

0:54:54.680,0:54:58.440
a baby, you don't want a too high fiber diet, 
but literally once they start moving into sort of

0:54:58.440,0:55:04.480
normal everyday food, you can start adding in that 
fiber. That's where we want to get people used to,

0:55:04.480,0:55:08.240
you know, the textures of things. And it isn't 
just about beans, honestly. It's, you know,

0:55:08.240,0:55:14.400
but seeds and nuts. I mean, how many children, you 
know, genuinely eat a lot of seeds and nuts these

0:55:14.400,0:55:20.680
days? Well, a lot of schools ban nuts, so they're 
not having it from 9 until 3:00 in the afternoon.

0:55:20.680,0:55:24.160
Do they get it for breakfast? I doubt it. So, when 
are they going to be having those? But with seeds

0:55:24.160,0:55:29.120
and nuts, unless you've got them in a bowl and you 
snacking on them or you sprinkle them over your

0:55:29.120,0:55:34.360
oats or your whatever your yogurt, when do you 
It's quite difficult to cook with seeds and nuts.

0:55:34.360,0:55:39.520
Well, I mean, again, nut butter, you know, 
put a put a bit of peanut butter into a soup

0:55:39.520,0:55:45.640
or into a curry, you know, to give it that lovely 
creaminess. and put it into a smoothie, you know,

0:55:45.640,0:55:51.360
or have it on toast. I mean, my my kids are 
great. Processed peanut butter. It shouldn't be.

0:55:51.360,0:55:54.120
It used to be. Yes. We used to add 
all sorts of sugar. So, we need to

0:55:54.120,0:55:58.480
just check and choose what an organic version. 
Doesn't have to be organic. I would say things

0:55:58.480,0:56:02.240
like with with peanut butter and almond 
butter. I think as long as we're getting,

0:56:02.240,0:56:06.240
you know, it's just the the nuts and some salt. 
Just check the ingredients is what you're saying.

0:56:07.880,0:56:11.640
That makes it accessible to most people. I think 
if you start making it organic, yes, there could

0:56:11.640,0:56:16.480
be slight benefits to that nutritionally. I'm just 
saying you don't want to make this too exclusive

0:56:16.480,0:56:22.480
for people. So enjoy your nut butter and but 
but think about places where it can be enjoyed

0:56:22.480,0:56:28.680
like your soup, your curry, your smoothie, your 
porridge. Yeah. My trainer at the gym actually

0:56:28.680,0:56:33.720
was showing me something. He goes, "Look, look at 
this label of this bread versus this bread. Look,

0:56:33.720,0:56:37.920
this one's got all these ingredients and 
this one's only got two ingredients." See?

0:56:37.920,0:56:42.160
And I was like, "Oh, wow." Oh, I mean [laughter] 
you're really taking us seriously. It was good. It

0:56:42.160,0:56:46.760
is good. But, you know, again, simple methodology 
here. So, I was in Sweden recently and I was sent

0:56:46.760,0:56:51.400
out. I was with my university friends and we were 
in a very remote place on a very remote island.

0:56:51.400,0:56:54.640
There was one shop on the island that happened 
to be open. We'd run out of bread. They sent me

0:56:54.640,0:56:59.080
to buy the bread. I had no idea. I don't speak 
Swedish. So, I just weighed them. And a heavier

0:56:59.080,0:57:04.480
bread is more likely to have less ingredients in 
it. Yeah. That That's And when I went home and did

0:57:04.480,0:57:08.600
Google Translate, I was like, I was right. I got 
the correct bread. So, just think about, you know,

0:57:08.600,0:57:12.920
if it's heavier bread, it's a better bread to buy. 
And there are all sorts of tricks like that. Okay,

0:57:12.920,0:57:17.920
we're going to have a a brand war here, but 
let's go into it. So, if you ask people,

0:57:17.920,0:57:22.080
what do you prefer? Do you prefer Burger King 
or McDonald's? We were having this conversation

0:57:22.080,0:57:27.040
in the car. We were deciding, you know, oh, 
let's have McDonald's. Okay. So, um and then

0:57:27.040,0:57:32.400
I'm not going to say who who said what, but 
one person said, "Oh, I prefer McDonald's

0:57:33.040,0:57:39.880
uh because it's softer and it's nicer to to chew." 
And then the other person said, "Well, I prefer um

0:57:40.520,0:57:45.240
was it Burger King cuz it's healthier. It's got 
it feels the meat's bigger or whatever." But the

0:57:45.240,0:57:50.160
consensus actually out of everyone was in in that 
car that day was that they preferred McDonald's

0:57:50.160,0:57:56.560
because of the softness. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz 
it's hyper palatable. Hyper palatable. Soft and

0:57:56.560,0:58:02.480
light. Yeah. You can just eat more and more of it. 
I mean, I I don't know about you, but if you did

0:58:02.480,0:58:07.320
eat McDonald's that day, um, how soon after were 
you hungry would be my question. It didn't feel

0:58:07.320,0:58:12.160
like food. Yeah. It didn't feel like had a meal. 
Yeah. [laughter] One breath and it was in. And

0:58:12.160,0:58:16.280
then I got bloated and I was like, great. Yeah. 
And I think that's the thing. It's whether people

0:58:16.280,0:58:21.280
are thinking of that as a whole meal, which, you 
know, every [clears throat] deal suggests a meal.

0:58:22.160,0:58:27.080
Every way that it's advertised suggests it is an 
entire meal. But I wouldn't see that as a meal.

0:58:27.080,0:58:30.560
I would see that as more like a snack. flat 
and small that you could have crumbled it up

0:58:30.560,0:58:34.880
into a little ball like that. How was that food? 
Yeah. No, but you know, but I didn't want to be

0:58:34.880,0:58:40.160
the party pooper. Yeah, of course. You know, it 
was a long drive. Everyone wanted it. You know,

0:58:40.160,0:58:43.200
they're all saying how wonderful it is 
and it's soft and nice and I was like,

0:58:43.200,0:58:49.400
"Oh." So, we did it and I gave in and I felt Yeah. 
It just felt didn't feel great and it just went.

0:58:50.080,0:58:53.640
The the difficulty in that situation though 
is if you had said something different,

0:58:53.640,0:58:57.800
I want to do this or I want to do that. Sometimes 
that can make you feel more anxious. It's

0:58:57.800,0:59:02.000
it's all about weighing it up. You don't want to 
be over worried about I never I mean literally the

0:59:02.000,0:59:06.280
last time I can't remember the last time I've had 
it or the kids really. It's like it does it's not

0:59:06.280,0:59:11.000
an often thing. It was exactly treat which I don't 
and I think that's the wonderful thing you know I

0:59:11.600,0:59:17.680
I see a lot of black and white in nutrition and 
I don't like it. I don't think any food should be

0:59:17.680,0:59:22.920
labeled bad. I don't think anything should be like 
you know obviously if it's poison don't eat it.

0:59:22.920,0:59:27.720
But if it's something that is going to if you 
eat loads of it harm you, it's okay to have not

0:59:27.720,0:59:32.560
very much of it. You know, just let's be sensible 
about this. Let's not kind of lose our minds over

0:59:33.080,0:59:38.400
all food has to be organic. All food has to be 
ultrarocessed free. All food has to be good food.

0:59:38.400,0:59:42.600
It it it doesn't No, I I know. And it it was nice, 
you know, it was a good atmosphere and everyone

0:59:42.600,0:59:45.760
was in a good mood and all that sort of thing and 
we were able to get get the food in the car and

0:59:45.760,0:59:50.360
just carry on the drive and everything, but it was 
so frustrating that there wasn't another option,

0:59:51.000,0:59:56.440
just something better, healthier, smoothies, farm 
food. But you're saying it's more expensive and um

0:59:57.040,0:59:59.520
and you think why when a 
lotments are the most, you know,

1:00:00.200,1:00:04.440
I know productive. I pass an a lotment 
every day on my dog walk and I'm like,

1:00:04.440,1:00:10.680
please give me the leftovers. Yeah. Please give 
me your surplus. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, so could

1:00:10.680,1:00:17.560
you list five pantry swaps that we can do now that 
will make us healthier? Yeah, great question. Um,

1:00:18.240,1:00:23.200
so I would say so things that you're in your 
pantry that you think like tomato sauce like

1:00:23.760,1:00:28.880
ketchup. Yeah, I mean if you're a family 
that eats ketchup, my kids love ketchup. Um,

1:00:28.880,1:00:32.840
I would go for a healthier ketchup, right? Because 
if there's one that's lower in sugar, that's a

1:00:32.840,1:00:37.520
great alternative. Yeah. And the same with any of 
your condiments if you if it's easier to make them

1:00:37.520,1:00:42.080
or you could make them or they're going to be But 
there's some great condiments out there that are

1:00:42.080,1:00:47.200
lower in sugar or like mayonnaise that you 
can get that's made with real ingredients.

1:00:47.200,1:00:52.480
Avocado oil or olive oil or any of those. So 
yeah, if you can if you're somebody that loves

1:00:52.480,1:00:56.800
a good condiment like mayonnaise, brown sauce 
or ketchup, I would switch those out for a

1:00:56.800,1:00:59.880
healthier version because if you're going to be 
eating a lot of it, then you want to make sure

1:01:00.640,1:01:06.360
a better version. Um, you know, obviously if you 
if you love your chocolate, I would say go dark.

1:01:06.360,1:01:13.120
If you can go dark, [laughter] that's going to be 
better. So again, a dark chocolate, it should be

1:01:13.120,1:01:18.760
70% cocoa solids plus and it shouldn't have any 
other added ingredients. Sometimes there may be

1:01:18.760,1:01:24.240
an emulsifier in there. Sometimes it's most 
likely to be soyless. Um, sunflower less than

1:01:24.240,1:01:28.560
slightly better. No, emulsifiers fine. They don't 
need to be there. There's plenty of chocolate

1:01:28.560,1:01:32.200
out there that doesn't have emulsifiers in 
it. Um, so I'd say yes, a dark chocolate,

1:01:32.200,1:01:35.360
a good quality dark chocolate. Do you know what 
I'm going to do with this? I'm going to chat

1:01:35.360,1:01:40.240
GPT all this stuff. I'm [laughter] going to take 
the lot and be like, of all these things I buy,

1:01:40.240,1:01:44.920
here's my shopping basket. You tell me which ones 
have emulsified and they're going to get banned.

1:01:44.920,1:01:50.480
We're going to go in the naughty naughty tofu 
step. Naughty step. [laughter] Um, so I would say

1:01:51.080,1:01:55.360
again if you're a family like again my kids, 
you know, they prepare especially my daughter,

1:01:55.360,1:01:59.200
she's been living away from home for 3 years, 
but she prepares a lot of food herself. Um,

1:01:59.200,1:02:04.760
and she knows exactly which brand of pasta sauce 
to buy that's cost effective and doesn't contain

1:02:04.760,1:02:10.600
any ultrarocessed foods. So again, if you're going 
to be using things like pasta sauce regularly,

1:02:10.600,1:02:15.120
and we're that family, she knows what brand to 
buy at home. I make our own and I just fill the

1:02:15.120,1:02:21.280
freezer with it. I also do the same with stock. I 
make my own stock paste. Honestly, people think,

1:02:21.280,1:02:26.120
"Oh my god, that's far too complicated." 
It really isn't. It takes me half an hour

1:02:26.120,1:02:29.880
and I'm not even doing anything for that half 
an hour. It's just simmering and reducing

1:02:29.880,1:02:33.480
and I stick it in a food processor and I blend 
it up and it's in the freezer and you can use

1:02:33.480,1:02:38.080
it straight from the freezer because it has such 
a high salt content. It doesn't actually freeze

1:02:38.080,1:02:42.800
entirely. And so I just use a tablespoon 
full of that rather than a stock cube.

1:02:42.800,1:02:47.480
Look at what's in stock cubes. Even vegetable 
ones, there can be a lot of other added things.

1:02:47.480,1:02:52.040
And I love a stock cube. It gives so much 
flavor and it's so much bang for your buck. Um,

1:02:53.760,1:02:58.440
something as innocent as a stock cube is not so 
innocent. I know. and a great flavor provider. So,

1:02:58.440,1:03:03.520
you know, um and then like cereals, we don't need 
to have cereals and I mean we discussed this at

1:03:03.520,1:03:08.000
the very, you know, start of this, but I think if 
we're looking at breakfast, think about swapping

1:03:08.000,1:03:12.920
out any other cereals that you have for, you 
know, something obviously oat based. It depends on

1:03:12.920,1:03:18.320
kind of what your vibe is. Some people love eating 
more like quinoa and um buckwheat as a as a grain.

1:03:18.320,1:03:22.240
And both of those are what we call a complete 
protein. They contain all nine of your essential

1:03:22.240,1:03:27.000
amino acids. They're actually a better choice from 
a kind of protein perspective than oats would be

1:03:27.000,1:03:30.800
and they're more traditional in certain cultures. 
So if you make like a buckwheat porridge

1:03:30.800,1:03:35.720
or you make buckwheat pancakes, that's not a bad 
choice for some people. Other people that you they

1:03:35.720,1:03:39.440
wouldn't thank you for that. They would rather 
have other sorts of, you know, pancakes, but

1:03:39.440,1:03:44.760
again, an oat pancake. I make an oat one all the 
time. Grind up some oats and some oat bran. And

1:03:44.760,1:03:50.720
then I use Greek yogurt or cottage cheese to keep 
the protein level high. And I use three eggs. Um,

1:03:50.720,1:03:55.880
and that is a great combination. And it's high in 
fiber, high in protein. Three pancakes. I can put

1:03:55.880,1:04:01.200
savory toppings on, which I more typically do. I 
can also put sweet toppings on and serve that. So,

1:04:01.200,1:04:05.560
swapping out your cereals for, you know, whole 
grains. I would say is it I knew I was going to

1:04:05.560,1:04:09.640
come and see you and I didn't want to have the 
guilt of sitting here opposite [laughter] you

1:04:09.640,1:04:14.560
and saying, "Alexandra, what did you have for 
uh so so actually before I came here, I I had

1:04:14.560,1:04:18.760
a [clears throat] little bit of um mints from the 
night before. Yeah. So, minced with onions and

1:04:18.760,1:04:25.200
all nice chilies and everything and a banana. But 
that's all I had time for. Protein bit of fiber.

1:04:25.200,1:04:30.520
Yeah. Absolutely. And that and that's what you had 
time for and you made time for that cuz you knew

1:04:30.520,1:04:34.720
you wanted to eat before you did a podcast. That's 
about prioritizing. You know, if you just sat

1:04:35.400,1:04:39.360
and your blood sugar was low, you would 
be you'd be perfectly fine because your

1:04:39.360,1:04:43.680
adrenaline would be flowing. But at some point, 
this is going to take its toll on your body.

1:04:43.680,1:04:47.680
And how many of us do that in the workplace? I 
know. I did it when I was in a corporate role.

1:04:47.680,1:04:52.760
You know, the vending machine was my friend. 
Sad, but true. I'm glad I stopped. Yeah.

1:04:54.880,1:04:58.560
Gut health. What What's the I 
mean, we talked about fiber. So,

1:04:58.560,1:05:03.440
that's the main thing. [clears throat] What 
else? So, prebiotics, probiotics, you know,

1:05:03.440,1:05:08.440
we talk a lot about probiotics, I think. So, these 
are the bacteria that we get from fermented foods

1:05:08.440,1:05:12.720
predominantly. So again, if we just look 
at what's happened over the course of time,

1:05:12.720,1:05:17.200
um, and we look at other cultures, excuse the 
pun, sauerkraut, kimchi, you know, the these

1:05:17.200,1:05:22.040
are foods that are traditional and they've been 
going for a long, long time. Kafir, um, you know,

1:05:22.720,1:05:25.960
and even yogurt, you know, that's probably 
the one that's been in the UK for the longest,

1:05:25.960,1:05:30.120
but we're quite happy to take other people's uh, 
you know, hand-me-downs, can you call them that,

1:05:30.880,1:05:36.360
ideas and make them our own. Um, so any of those 
foods that have been naturally fermented and again

1:05:36.360,1:05:40.240
you so my husband's of Germanic origin and 
he he had sauerkraut growing up but when I

1:05:40.240,1:05:44.440
actually made sauerkraut it was a whole different 
ball game because mine was fermented whereas the

1:05:44.440,1:05:48.840
one he'd been able to buy in a supermarket 
growing up wasn't it was a long life version

1:05:48.840,1:05:52.160
so it had been you know there was vinegar in 
there and there was a bit of sugar in there and

1:05:52.160,1:05:58.200
actually it wasn't sort of as acidic and um but 
fermented foods we get some probiotics from but

1:05:58.200,1:06:02.120
the thing that I think people are more aware of 
now is prebiotics so this is the sort of where we

1:06:02.120,1:06:07.040
get fiber in foods that feeds the good bacteria. 
So, for example, a banana. If we take a banana,

1:06:07.040,1:06:12.000
a really ripe banana, really sweet and sugary, 
actually much lower in fiber, prebiotic fiber,

1:06:12.000,1:06:16.480
than a slightly underripe banana. Now, you 
don't want to eat it where it's like green and,

1:06:16.480,1:06:20.360
you know, pasty. But you do want to enjoy a 
slightly underrite banana. It's going to be

1:06:20.360,1:06:26.000
higher in this prebiotic fiber and it helps. 
Excellent. Yeah. It's called resistant starch

1:06:26.000,1:06:31.960
essentially. Um, so it it it acts like a fiber 
in the body and you know, so I forgotten what

1:06:31.960,1:06:36.080
the question was again. [laughter] No, 
no. What for your gut? So about the gut.

1:06:36.960,1:06:40.320
I didn't know that actually. It's the same with 
your carbs. Actually, a lot of people don't

1:06:40.320,1:06:46.320
recognize that. What you can do is freeze or cook 
and cool and then even reheat carbs and you get a

1:06:46.320,1:06:51.520
higher level of resistant starch which helps with 
the gut health with gut health. So um you know

1:06:51.520,1:06:56.240
your bread. I always um get really good quality 
bread. I get it sliced so it's the right thickness

1:06:56.240,1:07:00.920
because if I slice it, it's too thick. And then 
I put it all in the freezer, take out slice by

1:07:00.920,1:07:04.840
slice so I don't waste any money because bread 
is expensive if you want to buy good bread. And

1:07:04.840,1:07:09.840
then I'll pop it into the taster and that'll be, 
you know, it'll be lower glycemic index. So it's

1:07:09.840,1:07:13.840
not going to affect my blood glucose as much and 
it will be higher in the right kind of fiber. But

1:07:13.840,1:07:19.240
things like onions, leaks, um, garlic, you know, 
those are really good foods and you cauliflower,

1:07:19.240,1:07:25.200
we all of these foods we should be getting more 
of. But again, if we skip the food preparation

1:07:25.200,1:07:30.240
process and we go to something that's already made 
or some source that's already been made, we're not

1:07:30.240,1:07:35.960
going to get the benefits of that prebiotic fiber. 
So prebiotics and probiotics. Um and and when it

1:07:35.960,1:07:39.280
comes to fiber, you know, if you're not used to 
it, which a lot of us aren't, have we haven't

1:07:39.280,1:07:44.320
had enough for a long time, don't introduce loads 
all of all of a sudden. You'll get some, you know,

1:07:44.320,1:07:49.720
nasty side effects from doing that and it'll put 
you off. So you want to gently increase your fiber

1:07:49.720,1:07:54.600
levels. And I find one of the best ways that I 
introduce with clients is, you know, via things

1:07:54.600,1:07:59.880
like flax seeds and chia seeds because they're 
very measurable. Um, sometimes people find beans

1:07:59.880,1:08:05.040
quite useful as well, but to supplement like the 
beef in your bolognese rather than to eat a whole

1:08:05.040,1:08:11.520
meal of beans. So just enter into it very very 
gently and change small things bit by bit because

1:08:11.520,1:08:15.640
if you suddenly introduce a whole lot of fiber to 
your diet, your gut will not know what's hit it.

1:08:15.640,1:08:19.680
You'll get some side effects that you don't 
want and it'll put you off wanting to carry on.

1:08:19.680,1:08:23.640
I see. I was going to say because I don't know 
how how many seeds chia seeds is too many. How

1:08:23.640,1:08:27.240
many flax seeds is too many? I know that you can 
have too much ginger. That ginger you should only

1:08:27.240,1:08:31.040
have a little bit like half a teaspoon a day 
or something. So, how do you know? Yeah. Well,

1:08:31.040,1:08:35.480
it is anti-inflammatory ginger and I would say 
you know you can put it into all your dishes and

1:08:35.480,1:08:39.920
whatever and and you turmeric and but again this 
combination of things that can be really useful.

1:08:39.920,1:08:45.160
So using turmeric, ginger and some black pepper 
combined can help with improving how your body

1:08:45.160,1:08:50.120
how how bioavailable it is to your body. So again, 
just these little tidbits of information like I

1:08:50.120,1:08:55.000
made this morning. I did some some dark chocolate, 
like little melted dark chocolate puddles, and I

1:08:55.000,1:09:00.240
just pushed in some freeze-dried strawberries 
because the anthocyanins in the strawberries

1:09:00.240,1:09:04.360
work synergistically with the flavonoids in the 
dark chocolate. So you get a better outcome,

1:09:04.360,1:09:07.920
better for gut health, better for So those 
those romantic images where you've got the

1:09:07.920,1:09:12.080
strawberry and they dip it in chocolate and give 
it to you're [laughter] actually really helping.

1:09:13.160,1:09:17.560
But these little things can really help 
help you, you know, make decisions like

1:09:17.560,1:09:20.880
when you're thinking about should I have 
this or that and I quite fancy both. Well,

1:09:20.880,1:09:24.240
I'll have that one because that one's going to 
give me a better outcome. That that's kind of

1:09:24.240,1:09:30.480
how my brain works. I heard I heard you need 
to have um ideally if you want to absorb iron

1:09:30.480,1:09:35.960
from meat or whatever, you need to have it with 
vitamin C. Yeah. Particularly plant-based um iron

1:09:35.960,1:09:41.280
sources that you really do need to you should be 
able to absorb enough from animal based sources.

1:09:41.280,1:09:45.840
There's no harm in having vitamin C alongside. I 
very often do. I very often have something like a

1:09:45.840,1:09:51.720
um an orange or something after a meal or 
kiwi fruit as my kind of dessert. Um but yeah,

1:09:51.720,1:09:56.480
certainly if you're eating plant-based iron 
sources and again things like cooking your

1:09:56.480,1:10:01.640
pulses in a pressure cooker, which reduces 
the phitates will make the iron from the

1:10:01.640,1:10:07.120
pulses more absorbable. So there's these little 
tips and tricks which that's why I do what I do.

1:10:07.720,1:10:12.840
Yeah. I think what we need to do is a followup 
on this and I and we need to go into a kitchen.

1:10:12.840,1:10:17.920
Come to my kitchen. I come to your kitchen. 
Whatever kitchen and a whole bunch of of of food

1:10:17.920,1:10:24.880
and then just look at the food and and prepare 
something. I mean yeah just like visually we'll

1:10:24.880,1:10:30.120
do like a little followup possibly just to help us 
cuz it's all it's getting absorbed but it's like

1:10:30.120,1:10:33.560
I want to get into a kitchen now and have a look 
and I want to I'm definitely testing the labels

1:10:33.560,1:10:37.360
and putting them into chat GPT. [laughter] This is 
now going to get very analytical. Yeah. It's your

1:10:37.360,1:10:43.720
next project. Yes. Yes. The next project. But but 
a final question. Um and I'm going to make it a

1:10:43.720,1:10:52.160
difficult one. One takeaway for people, one thing 
that if you could impart to them to give people

1:10:52.160,1:10:57.600
watching, one thing that's going to help them 
guidance, what would it be? Oh, that's a good one.

1:10:59.240,1:11:07.640
Um something that I haven't already said. Um 
that's a very good question. I mean, can I give

1:11:07.640,1:11:11.840
I can't give two. [laughter] You can't ask me 
for one. No, you can you can give. I do think I

1:11:11.840,1:11:17.000
do think uh try and listen to your body more than 
you listen to social media. I think that's a key

1:11:17.000,1:11:22.920
takeaway because I think we can get so distracted 
by the messaging that we see online and we can

1:11:22.920,1:11:28.680
start to overthink nutrition. And our body tells 
us much more than social media will ever tell us.

1:11:29.200,1:11:35.040
If you're sleeping well, if you've got energy, 
if your digestive system is working well,

1:11:35.040,1:11:39.440
you're not constipated, if you've got good skin 
and your hair is growing brilliantly and your

1:11:39.440,1:11:44.280
nails are nice and strong, great. If any of those 
things aren't working well, if you're struggling

1:11:44.280,1:11:48.840
to get pregnant, if you're finding your moods are 
up and down, if you find that your blood glucose

1:11:48.840,1:11:53.400
is dropping regularly throughout the day, think 
about what you need to do to address that. But I

1:11:53.400,1:11:56.760
I would urge people to listen to their 
body more than they listen to social media.

1:11:57.280,1:12:03.120
And I think the second thing is get label reading. 
You know, you may be surprised by what you find.

1:12:03.120,1:12:08.200
I think if you're only coming into this as a as 
a some as a newbie, as someone that's not really

1:12:08.920,1:12:13.520
thought about this before or or has thought about 
it, but not really known what to do about it,

1:12:13.520,1:12:18.480
I would look for emulsifiers and stabilizers on 
most products. And I wouldn't say be, you know,

1:12:18.480,1:12:23.200
black and white about it. You don't have to cut 
them all out, but just be aware if your diet

1:12:23.760,1:12:27.960
consists of a lot of products that contain those, 
have a think about where you might want to make

1:12:27.960,1:12:35.440
some changes. Those would be my two. Yeah. Yeah. 
For me, it's like um it's like a relationship, you

1:12:35.440,1:12:40.880
know? It's a breakup. It is a breakup. I I am I I 
don't go back, you know. [laughter] I'm going to

1:12:40.880,1:12:47.800
break up with emulsifiers and these stabilizers. I 
think I think that's the tough thing. We all have

1:12:47.800,1:12:52.880
to eat, you know, and we, you know, we do need 
to make some decisions that are right for us. And

1:12:53.520,1:12:58.240
if as mothers as well that are right for our 
children or our partners probably as well,

1:12:58.240,1:13:02.560
you know, we do have concerns for other 
people, that does tend to be part and parcel of

1:13:02.560,1:13:06.560
certainly I feel that way. I'm sure others 
do too. And and on that basis, you take that

1:13:06.560,1:13:10.400
responsibility quite seriously. And you know, 
if you are the person that's doing the shopping,

1:13:10.400,1:13:13.560
if you're the person that even puts the food 
in the cupboard that someone else cooks,

1:13:13.560,1:13:18.440
it's just making sure that as far as possible, 
things are as good as they can be within your

1:13:18.440,1:13:23.080
budget and within reason. So, I think you 
just got to be realistic about it. Jenny,

1:13:23.680,1:13:28.160
it's been educational. Good. [laughter] Thank you 
so much for coming on. Thank you for inviting me.